Fimo or sculpty question

[nuttiwebgal]

am I doing something wrong? everything I make with this stuff breaks.

no stamina at all. broke one of my gargoyles wings I made last yr.

and the fingers and nose off of my witch attempt.

seems like the slightest touch and to bad soo sad.

how do you ship such items that are so fragile.

and what does one do with a one winged gargoyle?

am I baking to long? not long enough? to hot?

I am soo clueless and clay challenged!

thanks for the ear and maybe some help!

nutti :lol:

[Anya]

Aww so sorry to hear your'e having trouble I hope I can help.

The clay should not be as delicate as you are making it out to be once it's baked. What make are you using? The best one I have found is puppen doll fimo. It comes in a large block and is very good quality. You can also buy a clay that is flexible like rubber and I add this to some of my clays but it is very much like chewing gum if you add too much to your clay and my first attemps at using it were all trial and error, but it helps with making the clay stronger and flexible. First of all you need to make sure that you knead the clay very thoroughly until it is very smooth to work with and not crumbly. Make your creation and bake it at a maximum of 150c and leave it in the oven for 30 mins. That's what I do with my animals anyway. If I am working on a large dog (great dane size) I will put him back in the oven once he's cooled down for an extra 20 mins.

You can repair the gargoyle wing by adding fimo to the break and moulding the uncured clay on the break joint back on to the broken wing if you know what I mean.

Also wire inside the fragile clay pieces is great for support.

BTW what kind of oven are you using? Gas, electric etc?

As for shipping fimo items you need lots of bubble wrap and just hope that it will stop your model from moving about.

Good luck :lol:

[Irene]

It could be that you haven't conditioned the clay enough. I have been using Kato Polyclay and the instructions that came with it read: Before using Polymer clay it must be conditioned. Kneading by hand until the clay is soft and pliable or fold and roll through a pasta machine. Inadequate conditioning will result in weakened finished items and weakened piece to piece adhesion.

[hydroped]

Hi Nutti,

I've heard that puppen-fimo is the best but it's just too pricey for me right now and they had some trouble with some colors for a bit there - not sure if they resolved them yet. I find that Sculpy is a little more fragile than Fimo. a wire frame helps that Alot. But I dont' use them very often. As for your broken garg - get some liquid fimo - put that on the the edge of the broken bit next to the body and sculpt yourself a new wing. I find the liquid fimo helps the new clay stick to the old clay - it may not be necessary but I really like doing it that way. Also check your overn temp. You should be able to get an oven thermometer at the dollar store - don't go to Wallmart they're expensive there but the dollar store should have some. - that's the most important thing - having the right oven temp - that's what I've always been told and from my own experience with breakage or undercooking I've found that to be true from experience too.

You can definitely fix your gargoyle. As for shipping I've used bubble wrap and boxes - I haven't shipped anything too big but i'd use one more layer of bubble wrap than you think you'll probably need :lol:

Hope this helps some,

David

[Charlene]

Sorry you're having troubles with your baked clay...I've also had some problems with Sculpey being fragile after baking, but no trouble at all with Fimo. Might be that I found Fimo easier to 'condition'. You can get conditioner to knead into it. From what I've read about baked clay, David & Anya are absolutely right -- if the oven temp is incorrect or the item is underbaked you're gonna have a breakage problem.

A one winged gargoyle could be very nice in a ruin or an old run-down cemetery. :lol:

[Anya]

Hi Nutti,

I've heard that puppen-fimo is the best but it's just too pricey for me right now and they had some trouble with some colors for a bit there - not sure if they resolved them yet. I find that Sculpy is a little more fragile than Fimo.

I have to admit that the puppen fimo block can last for ages and I have found that you get more out of the bigger block than the smaller ones and it works out cheaper in the long run. But it all depends on what you want to make I suppose.

Oh and the Gebhard (is that how you say it? :lol: ) Faber make is better than sculpey for the small blocks in my opinion. Sculpey is way too fragile for sculptures that will be handled alot.

[hydroped]

Hi Anya,

I haven't noticed a difference in getting more out of a bigger block than a small one. I'm always surprised when I open a small block at just how far it will go but I have to admit that I only buy the small blocks when I need a specific color for something - usually smaller items like pumpkins or plants otherwise I always buy my polymer clay in bulk. It's definitely more cost effective that way!

-David :lol:

[IrishMist]

I sympathize Nutti! I had the same problem when I started with the poly clays.

Condition! Condition! Condition! At least 20-30 times through the pasta machine. After the clay limbers up run it through on a rather thin setting and keep flipping the direction you run it through - side to top and back.

I also concur with getting an oven thermometer. If the temp is too low or time to short, you get leather items. Too hot or too long and they are FRAGILE!

I bake at 250 for 20 minutes per 1/4 inch thick. I always use a glass tray (old microwave glass bottom) and bake things of the same thickness together.

As far as shipping, if it's small enough I cut a section of a foam egg carton and wire the piece (lightly) into the egg cup and then put another egg cup on top, then pack that in plenty of foam or bubble wrap. Nothing has broken so far.

Hope this helps!

Carol

[Anya]

Hi Anya,

I haven't noticed a difference in getting more out of a bigger block than a small one. I'm always surprised when I open a small block at just how far it will go but I have to admit that I only buy the small blocks when I need a specific color for something - usually smaller items like pumpkins or plants otherwise I always buy my polymer clay in bulk. It's definitely more cost effective that way!

-David :lol:

Where do you get your clay from in bulk? Do you know I have been wanting to make a bulk order for ages but can't find a retailer who will sell me a load.

The little blocks of clay do go far for little things but now I notice that I am making larger animals the more clay I need so I've moved onto the big blocks because the little ones would end up being too costly . Hey do you ever get that problem where bits of fluff and things appear from nowhere in your clay (especially white clay) even when you have washed your hands over and over again and wiped down the working area? I hate it when that happens.

[Color Me Holly]

Nutti, I have instructions somewhere on how to test your oven using clay and an oven themometer. I can't find them. :lol: I agree with lots of conditioning. I use a pasta machine to condition mine, too.

Anya,

I asked about UK suppliers on the Clubhouse Forum I visit. I don't post much, but the members are really helpful.

http://theclubhouse1.net/ The link to the forums. There is a sculpting forum with sculptors, novice to professional, from all of the world.

I noticed these places didn't have colored in 1lb blocks, but they may be able to order it for you.

http://www.polymerclaypit.co.uk/

http://www.gocreateworkshops.co.uk/ The gentleman that runs this uses the name GoCreate on the forum

http://www.tiranti.co.uk/

http://www.jacobsonchemicals.co.uk/products.asp

http://www.commercialclay.co.uk/index.htm I think this place only sells pottery clay.

[nuttiwebgal]

thanks for all of the advice.

I do not have a roller for my clay but I do knead it quite awhile before doing anything with it.

so I guess I will just have to keep trying.

thanks again!

nutti :lol:

[hydroped]

Where do you get your clay from in bulk? Do you know I have been wanting to make a bulk order for ages but can't find a retailer who will sell me a load.

The little blocks of clay do go far for little things but now I notice that I am making larger animals the more clay I need so I've moved onto the big blocks because the little ones would end up being too costly . Hey do you ever get that problem where bits of fluff and things appear from nowhere in your clay (especially white clay) even when you have washed your hands over and over again and wiped down the working area? I hate it when that happens.

Hi Anya,

For Sculpy I went straight to the manufacturer. You can place a wholesale order by buying $50 worth at a time - you get the whole sale price but you do have to pay tax on it and of course shipping which can be a bit pricey because the stuff is heavy to ship. For Fimo I've only found doll pink or white in bulk and you can order that from d*** Blick Art Supplies they have a catalog and also a web site and so far we've had great service from them.

As to the bits of stuff in clay - oh you betcha. You really need to work in a dust free environment.. which unfortunately I don't have :lol: Most of my white clay though I use for push molds. I store all of my clay in drawers to help avoid dust when I'm not using it and Jamie Carrington recommends wearing white clothing while working on dolls - His Videos are Wonderful! - I also keep a lot of waterless hand cleaner near by and use it often on my tools and hands.

-David

[hydroped]

thanks for all of the advice.

I do not have a roller for my clay but I do knead it quite awhile before doing anything with it.

so I guess I will just have to keep trying.

thanks again!

nutti :lol:

Hi Nutti,

I have a pasta machine for my clay but I dont' use it - it can really save wear and tear on your hands if you have arthritis or any stiff finger joints but I hate dragging it out, setting it up and then worrying if I'm going to get an air bubble in the clay. I've learned to fold on the side, not the bottom - saves a LOT of airbubbles from happening but you don't need to over condition the clay - you just want it to be fully blended (if you've blended clay) or have a nice soft pliable feel to it. As for using an oven thermometer it's no mystery - just put one in the oven turn it on to the desired temp and after it heats see what the reading is. I had one oven that was 50 degrees off - it was an old used oven I bought for 15$ just to have something to cook on, then I had one that was designed to turn off and on at different temps it would go up about five or ten degrees above what it was supposed to then turn off till it cooled to five or ten degrees below then turn on again.. so it also wasn't the best oven. My mom had an electric that cooked very unevenly and eventually had to be replaced - and some ovens don't cook evenly throughout the entire inside - so I think an oven thermometer might be your best bet. At least you'd know the exact temperature of the exact spot you're putting your clay to bake. And I've found that my favorite oven for polymer clay is my toaster oven. I bought a cheap one - it burned Everything! - the shelf was just too close to the elements - then found an old one in the back of the cupboard that probably belonged to my grandfather - works wonderfully! but it's larger and the elements are a little farther away. Don't give up - just keep on trial and error and eventually you'll find what the problem is. I do know though that Sculpy has a bit lower resin content and is more fragile than Fimo when baked.

-David